Charles Marino on DHS being deployed to Portland – Fox News

20July 2020

This is a rush transcript from “Your World,” July 20, 2020. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated. 

DAVID ASMAN, GUEST ANCHOR: Violence erupting in Seattle and Portland, with no end in sight, a dozen officers injured in Seattle, many protesters there anything but peaceful, damaging and looting stores, targeting Amazon and Starbucks in particular.

Rioters also targeting a police union building, which was set on fire. Portland’s mayor claiming federal forces are escalating the situation. The president says he is prepared to send federal forces in to other cities as well.

Welcome, everyone. I’m David Asman, in for Neil Cavuto. And this is “Your World.”

Dan Springer is in Seattle, where tensions remain very high.

Dan, what is the latest?

DAN SPRINGER, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Yes, David, Seattle had been for the quiet the last couple of weeks, since police finally cleared out that CHOP zone.

But, yesterday, the violence and destruction returned in a big way. A large group of agitators and anarchists swept through downtown, many with baseball bats, breaking windows and looting some stores. They also tried to break into a police precinct.

But, when they were stopped by police, someone in the crowd started throwing mortar-style fireworks at the officers, at least a dozen injury — police officers were injured. One had to be taken to the hospital.

After that, rioters returned and went to another precinct, breaking windows and setting a small fire inside the building. Police did fire tear gas to push the crowd back. In Portland, meantime, there was a protest for the 53rd straight night, and again it was marred by violence and property damage.

Rioters tore down the fencing that was put up around the federal courthouse to protect that building. That allowed some of them to go right up and taunt the federal officers inside. Eventually, they did come out firing tear gas and less lethal rounds at the mob.

President Trump defended the actions of the federal officers today and said the strategy in Portland will be spread to other cities battling violence.


PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: These people are anarchists. These are people that hate our country, and we’re not going to let it go forward.


SPRINGER: Portland’s mayor, both U.S. senators from Oregon and several other elected officials are blaming the Trump administration for sending federal officers to Portland.

The state’s attorney general is preparing to sue the federal law enforcement agencies over some arrests that involve the use of unmarked rental cars. Mayor Ted Wheeler wants the fence delete Portland now.


TED WHEELER,  D-MAYOR OF PORTLAND, OREGON: We have dozens, if not hundreds of federal troops descending upon our city. And what they’re doing is, they are sharply escalating the situation.

Their presence here is actually leading to more violence and more vandalism.


SPRINGER: With all the chaos in the Pacific Northwest, police made just two arrests yesterday. They happened in Seattle — David.

ASMAN: Dan Springer.

Thank you very much, Dan.

The president says, these aren’t just protesters behind the violent protests in Portland in Seattle. He’s calling them anarchists, as you heard.

Neil spoke to the acting commissioner of Customs and Border Protection, Mark Morgan, all of this on “Cavuto Live.” Take a listen.


NEIL CAVUTO, ANCHOR: What do you make of, essentially, the powers that be in Portland saying, we don’t need, don’t want you, we think you’re agitating things by pushing troops on us? What do you think?

MARK MORGAN, ACTING COMMISSIONER, U.S. CUSTOMS AND BORDER PROTECTION: Neil’s, it’s just outrageous, it’s reckless.

And the president is right. It’s attitudes and policies like that, that actually beget the violence. Look, the argument that the mere presence of federal officers and agents causes violence, that is outrageous and it’s ridiculous.

And I believe that most American people do not believe that. What’s happening right now are absolute criminals. They are willfully organizing, planning and coordinating and preparing themselves and bringing weapons to these areas, with the intent to destroy federal property and harm federal agency officers.

That is criminal and that cannot be justified.


ASMAN: Charles Marino is a former law enforcement adviser to the Department of Homeland Security. He joins me now.

Charles, thanks for coming in.

What do you make of Mark Morgan’s statement?


Well, what we have seen since the death of George Florida is, we have seen peaceful protests be infiltrated by those of a criminal element that want to do harm to the communities and harm to police officers and other citizens.

So we know that fact to be true. But if we look at the reason why the Department of Homeland Security has gone into Portland, it was under the nexus of the protection of the federal courthouse there to assist the U.S. Marshals and the Federal Protective Service.

What we have seen is that we have now seen an expansion, where there’s almost a patrolling of the streets of Portland, in lieu of local and state authorities. I think that’s where the discussion needs to take us in, And is that problematic or not?

ASMAN: But let’s just deal with Portland for a second, because there was a specific case of a federal courthouse that was invaded by, not peaceful protesters, but by the Antifa bunch, who set off a firebomb, who climbed to the top of the building to disable a camera that was focused on the demonstrators, whatever you want to call them, but they were not peaceful.

How do you deal with them?

MARINO: Well, I think the Department of Homeland Security has every right.

And the secretary, the acting secretary, does have some broad power to send in enforcements to assist the Federal Protective Service in protecting that courthouse. The Federal Protective Service falls under the Department of Homeland Security, the U.S. Marshals Service, which has primary jurisdiction over courthouses, but uses FPS to protect those facilities.

It falls under DOJ. So, the secretary of homeland security is kind of moving that authority along and sending additional resources to help.

The bigger question is, does moving CBP off the border, Immigration and Customs Enforcement and other agencies away from their primary homeland security mission makes sense?

ASMAN: But I’m just wondering whether this is homeland security.

I mean, these are people in Seattle, to switch to a different city. You have armed Antifa militiamen, if you want to call them that, militia men and women, with walkie-talkies. The whole thing, it’s like they’re a small army that they have taken over the streets there.

What do you do, particularly when you have mayors in Portland, you have a mayor, Ted Wheeler? We just heard him speak. He’s a very progressive individual. There is nothing wrong with that. He’s he’s entitled to his opinions, but he’s not taking any police action to secure the streets from innocent civilians.

MARINO: Yes, I mean, it’s good point, David.

Listen, local politicians have the overall responsibility and an authority to oversee their — the local police departments that are responsible for safeguarding their commission. And, at the end of the day, if the local police departments aren’t doing that, then those local officials are going to have to answer to their citizens.

The bigger question is…

ASMAN: But what happens in the meantime? Forgive me for interrupting.


ASMAN: But we have a few months to go before the election and a few months past that to the inauguration of a new mayor.

And, frankly, Mayor Wheeler is heading up against a person running for his office, a woman who says, I am Antifa. So, if anything, if he’s not reelected, it’s going to get worse.

MARINO: Yes, I think what we don’t want to see is, we don’t want to — the same way we don’t want to see local law enforcement being politicized, we also don’t want to see the Department of Homeland Security being politicized.


MARINO: So that’s a good point.

But what really…

ASMAN: But we want to see Americans safe, don’t we?

MARINO: We do. We do. And there’s a good way to go about policing.

So what you hope is, you hope that the Department of Homeland Security and its resources are coordinating with those local law enforcement officials to put together some type of task force solution, in terms of helping to safeguard.

The problem here is, the local community does not want the help of DHS.

ASMAN: Right.

MARINO: So, what you don’t want to have happen, David, is, sometimes, you can make the situation worse and actually more dangerous, especially for law enforcement officers, if they’re not coordinating together to achieve the same mission, right?

ASMAN: Right.

MARINO: So, we want to make sure that that is happening.

ASMAN: Yes, the problem is very difficult. When mayors stand in the way of cooperation between the feds and local police, it’s a problem, local police who they are trying to defund at the same time, which is what’s happening in both Portland and Seattle.

Charles, great to see you. Thank you very much for coming in. I appreciate it.

Well, the state of Oregon is suing federal agencies, accusing them of violating protesters’ civil rights and — quote — “unlawful detentions” in Oregon. Do they have a case?

Let’s ask Fox News senior judicial analyst Judge Andrew Napolitano.

Good to see you, Judge. Thanks for joining us.

So, what is your verdict?

ANDREW NAPOLITANO, FOX NEWS SENIOR JUDICIAL ANALYST: Well, the federal government cannot put troops or military personnel or police on the streets without the invitation of the governor or the legislature of the state.

That’s not only federal law. That’s in the Constitution. And as horrific as it is for people who believe in the sanctity of the person and of private property to watch this destruction, there’s very little that the feds can do about it.

The Supreme Court has made it clear, as your last guest, the former police officer that he is, Mr. Marino, said, that health and safety is exclusively the province of the locals.

Now, here you have locals who look to Antifa and Antifa supporters for political support.


NAPOLITANO: Yes, so the local authorities, Mayor Wheeler, is not going to let the police do what they want to do. So you have a vise here. You have anarchy on one hand, and then, if the troops come in the street, you have a potential for even more violence on the other hand.

What happened in Portland over the weekend, David, was not only unlawful and unconstitutional. It was just plain wrong. Sending armed, untrained police into the streets wearing fatigues, without the knowledge or consent of the local police, actually caused more violence.

All the people that they arrested, David, they didn’t file one criminal complaint against anybody, because they didn’t have a basis to do so. They were just grabbing innocents off the streets.

ASMAN: But, Judge, here’s — the House Democrats are asking now the inspector general’s office to investigate the use of these federal officers to keep things under control there…


ASMAN: … because a lot of innocent people, not to mention business properties, individuals, private properties being disturbed, if not destroyed by all these actions.

Here’s what the Democrats say. They say that they are trying to object to the use of force against Americans exercising their right to peaceful assembly.

Well, as we have pointed out quite clearly with our video, this was anything but a peaceful assembly. We do have the right to a peaceful assembly, but what happens when that is violated by the demonstrators themselves when they become violent?

NAPOLITANO: And to make matters worse, when you have police whose hands are tied behind their back because the elected public officials, whom the Supreme Court says control the police — the police don’t control the elected officials, the elected officials control them — don’t want to do anything about it.

You have a lot of peaceful demonstrators. The complaint filed by the attorney general of Oregon against the Department of Homeland Security recounts horror stories of peaceful people being kidnapped, held blindfold, handcuffed and incommunicado for two — just two hours, and then let go.

There’s no reason to disturb those people. The people they should stop are the ones with the baseball bats that are destroying property.

ASMAN: Well, clearly, they’re trying to stop the people with the baseball bats as well. We have seen that. We have seen their attempts to do that, exactly that.

And we have also seen quite clearly the damage and destruction wrought on these two cities by very violent militiamen of the far left.

NAPOLITANO: So, the federal government can’t do what it doesn’t have the authority to do.

And it shouldn’t do anything without the coordination of the locals. And if the mayor, for whatever sound or perverse reason he may have, does not want the feds in his streets, and if the governor doesn’t ask for them or the legislature doesn’t ask for them, this is Madison, David. This is the Constitution.


NAPOLITANO: Then they can’t go there. It’s plain and simple as that.

And if the people are suffering, they have to elect a new mayor.

ASMAN: It’s extraordinary that somebody would put their political fortunes ahead of the safety of their own citizens that have elected them to office.

Judge, thank you very much.

NAPOLITANO: Indeed, it is.

ASMAN: Appreciate seeing you. Appreciate you being on.

Well, as fresh talks begin in Washington to get folks off the unemployment line, did the president just draw a new line.


TRUMP: I want to see it. I want to see it.

CHRIS WALLACE, ANCHOR, “FOX NEWS SUNDAY”: And if it isn’t in the bill?

TRUMP: I will have to see but, yes, I would consider not signing it if we don’t have a payroll tax cut.




TRUMP: We’re working and negotiating with the Democrats. I’m trying to get a plan that helps small businesses helps people, helps this country. And I think we have made a lot of progress on that.


ASMAN: President Trump claiming progress has been made with the other side in the urgent push for more coronavirus relief aid.

But he was joined by Republican leaders at the White House today.

That’s where John Roberts is standing by with the very latest.

Hi, John.


First to something that president just talked about. Of course, we have all gotten used to wearing these over the past two or three months, maybe a little bit longer than that, going into stores, having to mask up.

We now even have to mask up when we’re going into the press area of the White House. Well, the president’s been resisting this for a long, long time. But he seems to be of a different mind, tweeting just a few minutes ago — quote — “We are united in our effort to defeat invisible China virus. And many people say that it’s patriotic to wear a face mask when you can’t socially distance,” and with the photo of the president there in a mask saying, “There is nobody more patriotic than me, your favorite president.”

So, the president was not wearing a mask while he was in the Oval Office today. I and many of my colleagues in the media were. The leadership wasn’t either.

But the president did call us to a hastily called 11:00 a.m. pool spray, as he was there with Leaders McConnell and McCarthy. They were there to discuss the framework of a phase four coronavirus relief package.

The dollar figure by Steven — put by Steve Mnuchin is about a trillion dollars. That’s far below the $3 trillion measure that the House Democrats passed back in May.

Among the items that will likely end up in the Republican proposal, federal money as an incentive for schools to reopen, more money for vaccine, research and production, and a payroll tax cut giving workers an additional 6.2 percent in their weekly take-home pay.

Listen to what the president said.


TRUMP: It’s a big saving for the people. It’s a tremendous saving. And I think it’s an incentive for companies to hire their workers back and keep their workers.

So, a payroll tax cut, to me, is very important.

We’re working on it. And I don’t think there’s too much dispute as to the level of importance, John. It is a very important thing. OK?


ROBERTS: While there will be money for vaccines and treatments, there was no talk of more federal money to expand testing.

President Trump has maintained the reason that the United States has so many cases of coronavirus now is because we’re doing so much testing.

The House speaker, Nancy Pelosi, though, taking aim at the president for not increasing the federal government role in testing. Listen here.


REP. NANCY PELOSI, D-CALIF.: That it goes beyond ignorance. It’s just beyond the pale. Hopefully, it was a mistake, just — and they will back off it.


ROBERTS: Discussions between the White House Republican leadership have been going on for some weeks now.

Now it’s up to Senator Mitch McConnell to take it to rank-and-file Republicans.

Something else, David, that may appear in the bill, during that meeting, sources say, the president reached out to economist Art Laffer, who talked about the importance of transparency in health care pricing going into this fiscal relief bill.

The president said he liked the idea. So that may make it in.

And now, according to the president, it is patriotic to do this.


ROBERTS: So, I’m going to have to get one with an American flag emblazoned on it, or an eagle, you know, something like that.

ASMAN: Yes, it looks fine.

Just a quick question, John, before you go.

Is the president — he’s going to have a Corona Task Force appearance, apparently, tomorrow.

ROBERTS: He will.

ASMAN: We will be wearing his mask during that press conference?

ROBERTS: Well, that remains to be seen, David. I don’t expect so.


ROBERTS: I don’t know if the president would actually conduct a briefing with his mask on, but perhaps you have laid down the gauntlet. So we will see how he responds.

ASMAN: We will see. We know he watches this show.

John, good to see you. Thanks very much. I appreciate it.

ROBERTS: Thanks, David. You bet.

ASMAN: So, how does a payroll tax cut sit with Republicans?

Let’s ask Senate Republican Conference chair, Wyoming Senator John Barrasso.

Senator, good to see you. Thank you for being here.

Would you sign on to a new stimulus relief bill if it didn’t have a payroll tax cut?

SEN. JOHN BARRASSO, R-WYO.: Well, David, thank you very much for having me.

What we want to do is get people back to work, young people back to school. And we’re focused on legislation that will do that in a safe and sensible way.

We also need to save lives. And that means in terms of testing, in terms of treatment, in terms of a vaccine. And then, for a bill, I want to make sure it also includes liability insurance and protection for schools, for our health care workers, and for the mom-and-pop businesses that are trying to stay open.

With regard specifically to a payroll tax cut. it is one tool in the toolbox that works. It helps people who do have jobs keep more of their hard-earned money. It would probably add to two or three million new jobs, because it would make it more cost-efficient for employers to hire people.

So, there are absolute benefits to doing it. But there’s others things that we need to do as well.

ASMAN: All right.


ASMAN: But just to point a fine point on it, it doesn’t sound like the absence of a payroll tax cut in the bill would be a deal-breaker for you?

BARRASSO: No, it wouldn’t be a deal-breaker.

There a number of different things that we can do to help people get back to work and help young people get to school. That is one. I think one of the things we need to do is make sure we stop paying people more to not work than to go to work.

We have this bonus, this unemployment insurance bonus. That expires in 11 days.

ASMAN: Right.

BARRASSO: Nancy Pelosi, David, wants to extend it for another six months.

Three out of four people getting these payments, these bonus payments, would be getting more to not work than to go to work.

ASMAN: But, you know, Senator, that…

BARRASSO: We can’t do that. That’s a…

ASMAN: The absence of that, the absence of extending that $600 federal bonus for unemployment, might be a deal-breaker for Democrats.

BARRASSO: Well, it’s hundreds and hundreds of billions of dollars of expenses to be paid for taxpayer — by taxpayers.

And we know from the economists that it would likely keep 10 million workers out of work. That would be a terrible impact on our economy. It may be a deal-breaker for the Democrats, but it is expiring on July 31.

And it’s time for them to work with us in the best ways to get people back to work, kids back to school, and get our country in a way where people can wake up, go to work, feel comfortable, and make sure that their kids can be in school as well.

ASMAN: But, Senator, final, final comment, because we have a member of the other side of the aisle coming following you.

But if, in fact, the economy goes south as a — again as a result of the renewed viruses happening in the Southern states, that means a lot of people would remain unemployed. And these — a lot of these people have come to rely on that’s extra 600 bucks a week.

What would you say to them?

BARRASSO: Well, just what you just said there.

This is $600 a week, David, on top of the unemployment insurance benefits that they do get from their own states.

ASMAN: Right.

BARRASSO: We have a very generous program in Wyoming. We have help wanted signs all over the state of Wyoming, because, right now, in Wyoming, when you add $600 on top of our already generous unemployment benefits, many, many people are getting paid a lot more to sit at home than they would get paid to go to work.

And we cannot have that. That is a dramatic, heavy wet blanket on our economy. We want to get people back to work and kids back to school.

ASMAN: Senator Barrasso.

Great to see you, Senator. Thank you very much for coming in. Appreciate it.

BARRASSO: Thank you, David.

ASMAN: And, fair and balanced, Democrat Senator from Virginia Mark Warner, who sits on the Senate Budget and Finance Committee, joins me now. He’s well-positioned to talk about all these issues.

Senator, good to see you.

Let’s talk…

SEN. MARK WARNER, D-VA.: David, thanks for having me.

ASMAN: Sure. Let’s talk payroll tax reduction, first of all.

President Obama had one, as did President Bush before him, temporary ones, to deal with their own economic crises. So why not have one now?

WARNER: Well, David, I agree with my friend John Barrasso. It is one tool the toolkit.

I think the reason why you have not seen my Republican colleagues endorse it, for the most part, and the Democrats being pretty much opposed to it, is that, really, most of the benefit flows to the employer. It does nothing for people who are unemployed.

And it is not proven, based upon history with Obama and Bush, to be as effective a stimulant. And it potentially goes much more to higher-income people than lower-income people. It is a tool in the toolkit.

I don’t think, when we’re looking at 40 percent of the folks who make less than $40,000 a year losing their job, that it’s going to bring people back, or that it’s going to have the kind of stimulus that we’re — we’re dealing with really hardship times here.

And I think we all have to maybe check our ideological tools and really say, what can be the most effective?

ASMAN: But, Senator, let me just push back a little bit.


ASMAN: You say it does nothing for the unemployed. It does make it easier for employers to hire the unemployed. It makes it cheaper for them to do so.

There’s an incentive for employers to hire people, if they have a payroll tax deduction.

WARNER: Well, let me give you two things that I think would be smarter.

One would be legislation that I have gotten. There’s a Republican corresponding bill. Mine’s called the Paycheck Security Act that basically models after what the Europeans have used, where the government will, in a sense, directly pay a percentage of the income of the furloughed worker.

You don’t see the kind of double-digit unemployment numbers in Europe that we have seen here, because it — one, it keeps people connected to the workplace. It keeps them connected as well as with health care, because that’s another issue that has gotten not a lot of attention. As so many people lose work, they lose their health care as well.

And you can dial it using something that I was able to get in the last bill, the employer retention tax credit. So there’s a knob there. Senator Josh Hawley and Senator Cory Gardner have got a Republican version.

I think that is a more effective way to both help the unemployed and also encourage people to get back to work.


ASMAN: So, that’s what you’re going to focus on.

Now, let me ask…

WARNER: Well, that would be — let me just…

ASMAN: Yes, quickly.

WARNER: Let me focus on one other item I think is very, very important…

ASMAN: Sure.

WARNER: .. as somebody who spent longer in business than I have in politics.

We have seen 400,000 black businesses, many of them sole proprietorships, go out of business. Oftentimes, these are small businesses, only employ a few folks. But this has a cascading effect in terms of bankruptcies that will come out of that.

One of the reasons why black and brown businesses didn’t do as well with the PPP program is, they didn’t have as much established relationship with banks.

I have gotten legislation — and I believe I have had some good conversations with the Treasury secretary — that would make a substantial investment into black-owned banks and community development financial institutions that would help, long term, build up greater access to credit within black and brown communities in America.

That’s a long-term…


ASMAN: Senator, don’t you think those things should be colorblind?

WARNER: Well, I think they should be colorblind, but also be targeted on those who’ve been most affected by COVID.

I have got 8 percent of my population that is Latino in Virginia, yet 45 percent of the cases are Latino, about 20 percent black in my state, but close to 30 percent of the cases.

So, if you look at where the economic disruption has happened, I think we don’t have to call it color. Let’s just call it where the economic disruption is most taking place.

ASMAN: I think that makes more sense.

Senator Warner, thank you very much for coming in. Appreciate it.

WARNER: Thanks, David, as always.

ASMAN: Well, AstraZeneca and Oxford University offering some good news in the race for a coronavirus vaccine.

And did more Republican governors pushing mask mandates just get the president to come around?

Arkansas Governor Asa Hutchinson is here to talk about that.


ASMAN: So, is the push to go online turning college kids off of those pricey schools who aren’t lowering their tuition costs, even though they’re now going online?

Time to catch up with Kat. That’s next.


ASMAN: Well, some good news on the vaccine front today.

AstraZeneca and Oxford University reporting promising results from early human trials, but key word is early. And that may be why stocks didn’t do too much today.

FOX News’ own Greg Palkot is in London with more.

Hi, Greg.


Yes, that’s right, some encouraging early news about a possible — underscore that — possible cure for COVID-19, absolutely crucial.

Revealed today, the first human test results of a vaccine being developed by scientists at Oxford University, they described to us in a conference call earlier today. They described it as an important milestone. The drug possibly has good immunological response. That means it could provide short- and long-term immunity for the dreaded disease.

Important, too, David, it is also deemed as safe, with few side effects. Still, this is all based just on a test of 1,100 people. Now it’s being moved on to necessary broader field trials. That involves tens of thousands of people, South Africa, Brazil, and soon the United States.

And then, if it works — big strong if — it would be made and distributed by the AstraZeneca pharmaceutical firm, plus about $1.2 billion from the United States government in the mix; 300 million doses have already been reserved for the United States. They could be possibly available as early as December.

Here’s more of what the head of the Oxford project said today about the vaccine and its importance.


ADRIAN HILL, OXFORD UNIVERSITY: I think the vaccine is the way out. And I think that we’re going to need a lot of vaccine, because there was a hope that, if we had a vaccine question, we could put out the pandemic and it wouldn’t come back.

I think it’s going to be very difficult to control this pandemic without a vaccine.


PALKOT: Now, the Oxford vaccine, David, again, is just one of several vaccines being looked at, worked on, developed.

The idea is, get a lot of them in the works. Maybe one or two of them work. Then we see what happens. Billions of doses will be needed, all told, globally. Here’s hoping — back to you.

ASMAN: Here’s hoping, absolutely.

Greg, thank you very much.

Well, more colleges shifting to online courses in order to keep kids safe, but is that just keeping kids away? We’re going to catch up with Kat.

She is next.


ASMAN: More than three and for college students planning to return to campus this fall, but with many schools offering remote or hybrid classes, is it worth the full price of tuition?

Let’s ask Fox News contributor Kat Timpf.

Good to see you, Kat.


ASMAN: What can Harvard, which is not lowering its tuition, as far as we know, which is about $50,000 a year, what can they offer as an online semester that, say, Phoenix University or Florida University can’t provide?

TIMPF: Well, if you figure it out, let me know, because I certainly can’t seem to.

Some of these elite schools like Harvard, they cost a bunch more. And as far as I can figure out, it’s for two reasons. One is the prestigious name of the school. And two is the opportunity to rub elbows with the sort of people who would also be at an elite institution like this.

Well, now that elbow-rubbing is out for the foreseeable future in any situation…


TIMPF: … I guess the only thing left would be, oh, it has this reputation of being the best.

But I’m not sure that holds up either, because, essentially, these kids will be attending a different school. It’s an entirely different model to move entirely online. Harvard doesn’t really have too much experience doing this. Even if it was — was the best when it came to the old model of in- person classes and that sort of thing, these students are going to be Guinea pigs with how well this really works.

ASMAN: Right.

And at three times or four times the cost…


ASMAN: … those aren’t odds that I feel comfortable with.

I’m just wondering. If you were a student, would you want to be — take the risk and say, the heck with it, I’m going to be on campus, I’m going to find someplace where I can be on campus, because I need that personal interaction, it’s more fun, and that’s part of college?

TIMPF: I think so.

And at the very least, if — I think a lot of classes are going to be the hybrid option, some things are in person, some things are online. I think that this is a real opportunity for students to look at the cost of these things.

And if you can find a way to go to school somewhere cheaper, I know that enrollments are actually also going up in community colleges over previous years, which me — to me, community college, or at least doing your first few years, especially if you don’t necessarily know exactly what you want to go into, that’s something that’s always made sense, especially if you’re someone who needs to take out loans, who doesn’t have unlimited financial resources.

ASMAN: Right.

TIMPF: I think this just adds to what’s always been true. College was already too expensive. Now it’s laughable.

ASMAN: And finally, Kat, there are also problems with leading a virtual life.

Before all this virus stuff began, about a year ago or so, you saw all these psychological studies about how people who basically live their life online were very unhappy, some of them leading to suicide, et cetera.

It’s not healthy to live your life online, is it?

TIMPF: No. No, it’s not.

And, of course, we’re still studying this virus. It’s called novel coronavirus because it’s new. And I don’t certainly know how to open everything perfectly safely. Neither do the doctors who are experts on this.

But one thing that we have been studying for a long time is the impact of loneliness on the human body, not just in terms of mental health, where it’s an absolute disaster. It can lead to depression, anxiety and those sorts of things, but also physical health, increased inflammation, lowered immunity, and then quicker cognitive decline, particularly in senior citizens.

I wrote a piece about this for FOX News Opinion. And the reason I have a phrase — a problem with the phrase the new normal is that this isn’t normal for humans, based on our biology. And we do know that there’s going to be and that there already are that we’re seeing actual real health impacts of living this way.

ASMAN: Yes. It’s better to be person to person.

Now, we have to respect the virus because it is a danger.


ASMAN: But, at the same time, there are — sometimes, there are even worse alternatives, hard is that is to imagine.

Kat, great to see you.

TIMPF: You too.

ASMAN: Thank you very much for coming in. Appreciate it.

Well, Arkansas’ mask mandate is now in effect. What brought Republican Governor Asa Hutchinson to make the switch? We will ask him next.


ASMAN: Starting today, folks in Arkansas must wear a mask while in public, and repeat offenders could face up to a $500 fine, the mandate coming as COVID-19 cases keep rising there.

Arkansas Governor, Republican Governor Asa Hutchinson joining me now.

Good to see you, Governor.

Your decision to force the mask mandate seems to coincide with the president himself, who just said — now, he’s not advocating a mandate here, but he said that, in a tweet: “We are united in our effort to defeat the invisible China virus. Many people say it’s patriotic to wear a face mask when you can’t socially distance. There is nobody more patriotic than me, your favorite president.”

And he has a picture of himself wearing a mask.

I guess people realize — I mean, Fauci — Dr. Fauci at first said, we shouldn’t wear a face mask. Now he says we should. People are discovering more about this virus all the time. And they have to adjust their policies accordingly, right?

GOV. ASA HUTCHINSON, R-ARK.: Well, that’s right.

Whenever you look back, in March and April, what we know now is much more advanced. We have learned a lot about how the virus spreads.

And you have got to continue to listen to the medical experts. They’re not perfect, but they look at the science of it and the data, and whenever they say that this is one thing that makes a difference in terms of the spread, I want to listen to them.

And it’s not something that I wanted to do. It’s probably not something the president wants to do. But I’m delighted that he went and posted that on his social media account today, because, for those who’ve heard mixed messages, all of a sudden, we’re united now in the United States.

We’re all together, understanding that this does make a difference and this is what we need to do.

I look at wanting to have school in a couple weeks, actually about a month here in Arkansas, and we have got to get ready for that. We have got to reduce the cases, the hospitalizations, the positivity rate.

And this is one thing everybody can own…


HUTCHINSON: … be engaged in and say, I’m going to do my part.

ASMAN: By the way, are your hospitals now beyond capacity, particularly your ICUs?

HUTCHINSON: They’re not.

We still have ICU capacity in Arkansas. We have got hospital capacity. But it depends upon the region of the state. It can be tight, because they’re using them for other purposes besides COVID-19 patients. And that’s a good thing.

And so it can be tight. It is tight. And we’re trying to make sure that we can relieve some of that tension for our hospital workers.

ASMAN: Why do you think there — we are seeing a spike in cases in states like yours?

HUTCHINSON: Well, we are testing more, but it’s much more than that.

The virus has actually spread into the community. We’re fortunate in Arkansas, in the sense that it has spread broadly. And so I think, with good contact tracing, with everybody following the guidelines and wearing a mask, that we can curtail the increasing cases, but — and we also — while we have had an increase in testing, we need to increase that more.

And that’s a challenge for us right now, because we’re struggling with our commercial labs. We’re increasing our Department of Health testing, but our commercial labs is really at capacity because of what you see across the United States. And that hurts us in being able to expand and to do more.

ASMAN: There is good news. And we don’t want to bury that at all.

And that is this dramatic decrease in the mortality rate in the United States. The observed case fatality ratio — that’s the name that they give to this — has gone from 4.8 percent on June 30 to 3.7 percent now. In less than a month, that’s a 23 percent decrease in the fatality rate of someone who has the COVID virus.

That’s awfully good news, is it not?

HUTCHINSON: Well, it is very good news.

Whenever you look at the fact that our hospital workers, our physicians have learned better therapeutics, they can do more advanced treatment. They have a better success rate. So this is great news.

And that’s what we have tried to do, is to flatten that curve. So we have opportunity to be able to get the vaccine, which is another part of the good news, that we hope that that’s on the horizon.

And then the fact that we’re treating patients more effectively…


HUTCHINSON: … really indicates that we can make some progress and win this battle.

ASMAN: Governor, we only have 10 seconds, but this is not going to change, the current level of cases is not going to change your decision to open the schools in a couple of weeks, right?


I — we — as you discussed earlier, we have got to do this for mental health for our children, for education. We have just got to do it the right way and the safe way. And that’s what we’re working on.

ASMAN: Governor, we wish you the very best. Thank you very much for coming on.

HUTCHINSON: Great to be with you. Thank you.

ASMAN: Appreciate it.

Well, with workers striking, which party should be worrying? We will tell you next.








ASMAN: A major union mobilizing a strike by fast food and other service workers in support of racial justice today.

But with unemployment levels at not seen since the Great Depression, is now really the time to be going on strike?

Fox News political analyst Gianno Caldwell joins me for more on this.

What do you think’s going on here, Gianno?

GIANNO CALDWELL, FOX NEWS POLITICAL ANALYST: I find it pretty interesting that a lot of organizations and movements are taking foothold when it comes to George Floyd to advance their causes.

We see this oftentimes with liberals when they consider things to be civil rights issues which aren’t civil rights issues, so they can advance their own movements. It’s very unfortunate, especially considering the fact that unions post-slavery didn’t really to do — have too much to do with African-Americans.

My grandfather, a small business owner in plumbing and construction, often talked about how unions really didn’t care about the African-Americans who sought out work.

Now, this is very interesting, especially considering unions are getting a lot of what they want. When you look at the numbers, especially when you talk about wages, 24 states and 48 cities — 48 cities and counties will raise their minimum wage 2020.

We’re talking about this $15 an hour that they keep talking about. Of course, the federal wage is $7.25 and has been the case since 2009. But things are changing.

You’re talking about 29 states with 61 percent of the U.S. work force currently pay above that $7.25 an hour. So we’re seeing a different dynamic take place.


CALDWELL: And I feel like that is really trying to take advantage of a moment, very unfortunate.

ASMAN: So it’s opportunism, as much as anything else.

But one thing that they’re not getting, the unions, are new members. The membership has gone from 16.8 percent of the work force unionized 25 years ago down to 6.4 percent. So, that’s what they’re really trying to do, is juice up their membership, right?


And it’s always the case. I remember working for the federal government some years ago. Oftentimes, you had to really belong to a union and pay in for so many individuals. And the unions, they protected a lot of people who didn’t need protecting.


CALDWELL: These are people, and a lot of them that needed to be fired, who didn’t come to work, who didn’t care about their jobs, and they still protected these individuals.

So, when we’re talking about who’s deserving of these increases, we can look at what companies have already done. When tax reform was passed, if you recall, a lot of companies said, hey, we’re not going to go into stock buybacks. We’re going to pass this on to our employees.

And a lot of companies waged — raised, rather — raise wages, and given other opportunities to employees. And that’s what we should be seeing, especially considering now we’re coming out of COVID and an economy that’s been completely and totally decimated.

ASMAN: Well, absolutely.

And you know one group that’s been decimated are the franchisees. And they’re — we’re not talking millionaires here. We’re talking people who make from $50,000 to $100,000 a year. They pay themselves that much, the people who own the franchises.

They’re the ones that are going to suffer the most from strikes if they happen.

CALDWELL: Well, I would argue that it’s actually the employees who will suffer the most, because what we have seen time and time again when unions come in and say, hey, we want a higher wage, or we’re leaving, companies end up replacing people with technology.

We see that all the time. If you go into your local McDonald’s right now…

ASMAN: That’s right.

CALDWELL: … you will see a bunch of machines that you put your order in, and maybe you go get it from — you go get it from a person, because they prepare the orders.


CALDWELL: But guess how many cashiers you could have had?


ASMAN: That’s right.

CALDWELL: And now you don’t know.

ASMAN: No, and it’s not just McDonald’s. You see it at a lot of the fast order places as well.

CALDWELL: Many other places, absolutely, absolutely.

ASMAN: Gianno, as always, you put things in perspective. Good to see you, Gianno Caldwell. Thanks very much.

CALDWELL: Thank you so much, David.

ASMAN: This time tomorrow, President Trump and his Coronavirus Task Force will be resuming those coronavirus briefings.

We will be on that, specifically whether the president wears a mask or not. That will be interesting.

Plus, we’re going to be talking to Homeland Security Deputy Secretary Ken Cuccinelli on the actions the White House will be taking this week.

More on that tomorrow.

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